>>18433763
You're right, that's why I converted to Judaism. If I fuck up, we all get persecuted and massacred.

>>18433766
Unironically a more virtuous life than Christianity.

>>18433768
The actual point of Christianity before Paul came in was for the gentiles to embrace Judaism, they just didn't have to be circumcised. James, Peter, John, and Paul were all there at a meeting in Jerusalem. This is recorded in the Acts of the Apostles, Chapter 15. The entire goal was to make the nations virtuous. Paul carried this letter to Antioch. So when he says in his letters that he taught people to eat meat polluted by idols he directly defied James, the brother of Jesus, and the rest of the pillars.
>“It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

>>18433763
Correct. Everyone does their business in the toilet, but the businesses are of different kinds: Some make a mess, and others clean it up.

this is false. christ preached a pagan non judaic religion that preached all men are or perhaps can become christ the living god. this is according to personal research deep study and thinking deeply. believe it, or dont idc. the vatican knows this.

>>18433787
Gnosis doesn't come out of a crack pipe.

>>18433788
you can call it gnosis yes. christ preached it. vatican preserves it to this day. protties have no clue at all literal christian jews who eat pork. orthodox might be based on pre christian greek philosophy i theorize they took their ideas from the shamans of the middle east that existed up into the islamic times al biruni called them shamaniyyun they say its buddhism i dont believe it.

>>18433787
>>18433803
meds time, methinks

>>18433763
Your “good works” (in reality sins committed with pride) will send you straight to hell. Salvation is only found in Christ.

>>18433913
kys homosexual sodomite.

>>18433917
Disgusting wretched, anti human cult.

>>18433763
Other than the heretics in America, are there really any Christians who believe you shouldn't try your hardest to live a virtuous life?
Have you not read the lives of saints? Are they not given to us as an example of what it means to be a Christian?

>>18433763
I'd argue the opposite actually. Atheists usually are atheists because they want to sin without having to repent for it. Such things as hard drug use and promiscuity figure into this.

>>18434040
This. If Christianity were easy to practice and had actual societal benefits atheists would do it, but they don't because they love their sins.

>>18433763
Only protties believe that believing is enough to be saved. Theosis is the right path to salvation. This concept is completely foreign to them.

>>18434063
Theosis is an eternal process

>>18434063
Define theosis and define saved

>>18434069
Alignment of the soul with God's will. Saved, meaning the soul is justified and therefore not subject to eternal damnation in Gehenna.

>>18434078
Is justification a legal declaration, and if so what is its ground?

>>18434080
It's a spiritual orientation

>>18434069
>theosis
The lifelong process of slowly being transformed into a better person by trying to live by the teachings of Jesus Christ.
>saved
Being justified in the eyes of God as a righteous person. Communion with Him.

>>18434082
Not in the New Testament, so this is heresy

>>18434085
Is one’s personal theosis the cause of their justification?

>>18434086
I didn't know you followed the Law of Moses in its fullness.

>>18434089
I didn’t, but Jesus did.

>>18434090
So then how are you justified if it's not legal? Oh, it's about whether or not your soul believes in Christ and submits to God?

>>18434088
Its about the orientation of your heart. Thats what justifies you. If you are truly trying to seek Him despite the occasional tumble then you are (probably) saved. You are damned if you are trying to see it in a legalistic way, it doesnt work like that. Its about you genuinely trying to follow Him despite your flaws. To turn your heart towards Him. Being honest about it is the key, salvation cant be gamed.

>>18434040
The issue is many of the "virtues" proposed by Christianity are not virtuous at all. Such as not resisting, and praying for your enemies.

>>18434679
>Such as not resisting
Its about breaking the cycle of hatred, dont get it twisted. Eye for an eye and the entire world ends up blind.
>praying for your enemies.
Praying for their conversion, yes. That they stop their ways before its too late. Whats wrong with that? Hate the sin, not the sinner.

>>18434715
>Hate the sin, not the sinner.
if only you people actually followed that advice. Have you ever told someone to kill themselves?

>>18434726
Yes, but only if they are transgender.

>>18433957
> anti human cult.
99% of humans don’t deserve to live

>>18434726
don't most anon tell you to kill yourself out of love, rather than out of hatred?
its all like a brothers love.

thats how I read it when it comes up anyway.

>>18434726
Back when I was an atheist, yeah

>>18434732
God evidently says otherwise considering that they live in spite of your misanthropy.

>>18434735
Huh. I decided not to tell people that anymore because it's a horrible thing to do and I wanted to be a better person, not because I'm afraid of God punishing me for it. We are not the same.

>>18434748
>implying its out of fear
I assume some christians might have that relationship with God, but for me its more about wanting to have a genuine relationship with God. And part of that is honoring Him by trying to follow His teachings by trying to become a better person. Good for you if you realized that by yourself I guess.

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>>18434753
>I assume some christians might have that relationship with God
Your holy book (which I doubt you read) literally instructs you to have this kind of relationship

>>18433763
No matter what kind of life you've lived, you've still made mistakes. For example there are things you know would be good to do, and you didn't do them. There has to be price to pay for that, and that is what Jesus Christ paid for. If you will not submit to the righteousness of God, and instead want to depend on your own righteousness, you are rejecting the salvation that Jesus Christ is offering you.

That is why people go to Hell. They can't imagine God sending a person like themselves to Hell because they wouldn't do that. So they are saying, "God, since I wouldn't do that and You would, then obviously I am better than you." No, you are just more tolerant of sin than the Lord is. That is evidence of your unholiness, not your holiness.

Christianity is not "get saved and then do what you want", you will be chastised by God and it will not be fun. It's "get saved and then do good works, not to get saved but because you are grateful and because you want to do what God wants you to do".

Rom. 3:23-25: “For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;”

The gift of salvation can't be earned, it's a gift: Eph. 2:8-9: “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”

Rom. 10:9: “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.” Confess The Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in prayer, that you trust in Him, not your own works. He atoned for your sins on the cross.

>>18434760
>No matter what kind of life you've lived, you've still made mistakes.
And? Why do we have to be perfect (or made perfect through Jesus)? Why would a god deliberately create flawed beings if that isn't what he ultimately wants? Stupid.

>>18434758
>which I doubt you read
Lol. I see it more as a father figure relationship. They dont call Him the Father for nothing. The parable of the prodigal son really gives insight into what kind of dad He is. Back when you were a child you were afraid your dad would give you a beating if you misbehaved no? But at the same time you (hopefully) knew he loved you. Its the exact same relationship we are called to have with God. And arguably a healthier one.

>>18434763
>Lol. I see it more as a father figure relationship
I'm not really concerned about how you personally choose to see it to make yourself feel better. I'm concerned with what the Bible actually says.

>>18434763
>Back when you were a child you were afraid your dad would give you a beating if you misbehaved no?
And no. I didn't have psychopathic abusive christian parents. I was never afraid of my parents hitting me. What a fucked up post.

>>18434764
You are entitled to your wrong exegesis of scripture. But do you think its healthy for a child to be terrified 24/7 of his own father? Would you not rather have a relationship in which you know what your dad is capable of (and fear him for that) yet have an actual loving relationship with him?

>>18434771
>But do you think its healthy for a child to be terrified 24/7 of his own father?
I think it's abominable for a child to be afraid of his parent in any amount. You are sick.

>>18433787
Heresy
>>18433788
Truth
>>18433803
Heresy
>>18433913
Advice, but given with a flavor of delusion, almost as if you believe you are talking to someone else.
>>18433928
Don't let that nigga get you down, and also probably start some medication.

>>18434775
With all due respect, I dont think you are smart enough to engage with what I am saying in all honesty. Given your propensity to ignore all the points I am making, instead it seems you are more interested in getting a reaction out of me since I profess to be a christian, are you trying to tempt me into telling you to kill yourself or something? Is that the game here? I thought you could be the one to give /his/ atheists a good name for once but seems I was mistaken.

>>18434762
Probably because that would require humans to have no free will to choose between good and evil. If everything was good and perfect including humans they wouldn't have the choice of choosing God since they aren't separated to begin with. God wants people to choose to depend on Him, not because He made them, but because they chose to out of their own free will. Evil has to exist for that choice to be possible. We are flawed to make us realize that no matter what we need to be saved by God because of our flaws, not to think "im good enough" in our pride and reject God. If you want to reject God, that option is available, but God has clearly warned us that the result of that is something you will regret, because wicked people go to hell.

>>18433766
You joke but multiple denominations of Christianity basically reinvented Judaism. Every branch of Calvinism, and most born-again branches of Evangelism, operate this way.
>I am a member of God's chosen people.
>Nothing I say or do can take this from me, heaven is my birthright.
>Everyone else on Earth are subhuman animals that exist only to serve me.
Sound familiar? The only difference is how exclusive the club is. For sects that believe in predestination where your status as the Chosen People was made before birth, the religion is 100% Jewish. For sects that require you to be re-baptised and take a new name to enter the Chosen status, it's only 75% Jewish. But the common theme is that as time progressed, more and more people got filtered by the demand to produce Good Works as an entry condition to heaven, and so reinvented ways to declare themselves as God's Chosen People so they wouldn't have to do that.

>>18435257
Yeah, Islam is the exact same way. People want the favor of the divine to feel confident in their decisions. They can’t live with nauseating utter freedom.