i think i'm most irked when redditoids like that stake some level of ownership by saying "OUR understanding," as if they contributed or forge new understandings and breakthroughs in any way and aren't just parroting what their high priests tell them

>>16952021
Not sure what the thing about Neptune is, but dinosaurs having feathers is just a question of fact. You could technically define "planet" as "the eight planets plus Pluto" but it would be an internally inconsistent definition.

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>>16952021
are you talking about le feathers? who gives a shit?
and neptune? do you mean pluto? it still exists, the planet thing is just a stupid meme, you can call it anything you like
retard

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>>16952021
Every academic generation needs to spray their cat piss all the over the canon. If there's nothing to add, we just rearrange the furniture a bit, as with Pluto. Or reupholster it, like inventing an entirely new taxonym instead of just saying superkingdom or bleaching the wonderful old jewels AD and BC to the more notationally-awkward CE and BCE for no particular reason other than the fact that we enjoy the smell of our own cat piss. Some of this washes off in another generation or two; some stinks on a lot longer.

>>16952039
You can understand something without being involved in that thing's discovery, you know?

>>16952066
The Pluto thing is because people discovered a bunch of other objects like Pluto and at some point they realized that it's inconsistent to call Pluto a planet but not them. So it was either add all the dwarf planets to the list, or subtract Pluto.

>>16952075
I'm not really against generational cat piss, as frivolous and narcissistic as much of it may be. It is what it is. But there are a ton of flaws that come with carving out Pluto, some of which should prove fatal in the long run, I reckon, such as the fact that Earth wouldn't even "clear" Pluto's "neighborhood" if you swapped it with Pluto.

>>16952152
Are you denying the premise that Pluto is more relevantly similar to the other dwarf planets than to the main 8, or just being precise?

>>16952152
>Earth wouldn't even "clear" Pluto's "neighborhood" if you swapped it with Pluto.
???
What makes you say that?

>>16952152
Yeah, I am not a fan of the "clearing orbit" criteria myself; personally I would have gone with object is at least X diameter or something. Say more than 4000 km (Mercury is like 4800 km) to use a nice round number.

>>16952152
>>16952190
The point of neighborhood clearing takes into account the dynamics surrounding the formation of bodies: Planets are the bodies that manage to accrete enough mass within their particular formation area to gobble up all the other comparably-massed objects because two comparably-massed objects aren't going to be able to maintain stable orbits unless they collide and fuse or one migrates as a result of an interaction. Earth is what is left from a bunch of sub-Earth-sized bodies accreting and colliding and there are no sub-Earth-sized bodies remaining in our orbital path. Neptune is what is left from a bunch of sub-Neptune-sized bodies accreting and colliding and there are no sub-Neptune-sized bodies left in its orbital path. And so on the MBAs and KBOs aren't planets, they're the table scraps leftover from the dynamics of planet formation.

Hell, Pluto would have been gobbled up or ejected from the solar system if it hadn't slipped into an orbital resonance with Neptune like a lot of the other KBOs.

>>16952021
rape

I wish normalfags never discovered Touhou

>>16952021
The inability to separate semantics from factual matters is shockingly common. I'd call it a trait of peak midwittery, but I feel like the average person should be able to do that.

>>16952021
My gripe with scientists is that the public facing ones tend to be narcissistic cult leaders who bullshit relentlessly and harp about the dumbest fucking shit because slackjawed idiots in media positions will praise them endlessly for it.

Aside from the arbitrary definition of what is a planet it's true Pluto wasn't formed like the other planets and it's not even the only one of its category.
It actually makes pluto more interesting.

>>16952071
Unironically no, except if you happened to discover it independently with no more clues than the first discoverers

>>16952021
>pluto
there's no reason why we couldn't keep calling it a planet, except the raging autism of some people
>dinosaurs
>neptune
no idea what do these refer to.

>>16956103
>dinosaurs
refers to the fact that many dinosaurs apparently had feathers or otherwise diverged from their classic mid-late 20th century appearance as portrayed in Jurassic Park and plastic toys.

>Neptune
probably about how Neptune is now known to have (and is sometimes depicted with) rings, like Jupiter or Saturn.

So yeah it's literally "they changed something from my childhood and I hate it"

>there's no reason why we couldn't keep calling it a planet
Well it's a "dwarf planet", one of many.

>>16956259
>like Jupiter or Saturn
*like Saturn and Uranus, Jupiter also has rings of course but like Neptune's they're not very visible.

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>>16956259
Actually it's probably about the color.

>>16952021
It's all "make-work"
A con. Fake. A scam. Made up nonsense.
And if course does more harm than good because it creates a giant system of false science.
Can't build and live and cope in the real world when trying to work off of a fake system of nonsense.

>>16952055
>but dinosaurs having feathers is just a question of fact
for some, some had scales, and some had both!

>>16956894
True. But at least some certainly did. (And you'll note I didn't specifically say that it was a fact, just that it was a *question* of fact, i.e. there is a fact of the matter whether or not any given dinosaur had feathers in a way that there isn't a fact of the matter whether Pluto is a planet.)

>>16956259
>probably about how Neptune is now known to have (and is sometimes depicted with) rings, like Jupiter or Saturn.
But that was always a thing. When I was a kid 20 years ago I saw plenty of photos of Neptune with small, faint rings.

>>16957759
Are you sure you're not thinking of Uranus? Did the rings cross the poles?

>>16957763
My WHAT?

>>16957772
I said a dumb. But Uranus does have rings.
They don't "cross the poles" per se but they do run roughly perpendicular to the planetary plane because Uranus has a grossly tilted axis of rotation (again: roughly perpendicular to other planets).

... Uranus is sideways.

>>16957759
Yeah in retrospect it was probably
>>16956283

>>16952156
>are you denying X or blah blah Y
Neither. The demotion of Pluto isn't my bête noire; it came from OP, not me. But I'll happily throw you into a vat of cat piss for that silly "denying" meme.
>>16952165
I forget the guy's name. His variable was lambda. His math was used to evict Pluto. He disagrees with the eviction and claims his math was abused. I'm sure a cursory search on jstor or similar will turn up whatever you need to fill in the blanks.
>>16952190
>>16952237
That's the easy lie. The truth is messier and you have to reconcile the mass and speed of all the rocks out there, Pluto's active geology, m m m my Charona, and a bunch of other factors.

we need to recombobalute dino dna with a doohickey ding dong like they did in jurassic park.
can't wait to see a real t-rex.

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>>16952021
Which some exceptions their motivation is to understand reality and find the truth.
I'll never understand people that literally can't handle the truth.

>>16952021
>our understanding if the world has grown
this is demonstrably false
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cUR4up6EBLA

>>16952021
They do it to be famous.

>>16952075
The pluto thing really was some asshole trying to be famous. Ceres really needs more credit for being huge.

The idea that it was a selfless redefinition for logical consistency is naive. It also doesn't fundamentally matter how you categorize or label the planets. Neptune and Uranus are dissimilar from Jupiter and Saturn despite them all being gas giants. Oort cloud dwarf planets are icy in a way that Ceres and closer are not.

>>16952066
>showing weakness to an apex predator
sad

>>16958934
Didn't work. 99% of people credit Black Science Man for having Pluto demoted instead of Mike the white Brown.

>>16958934
Eris is more massive than Pluto. The redefinition was genuinely just to have some consistency. Either add planets or add a new class of objects.
Trying to ascribe some sort of self-serving motivation to such a benign thing is childishly cynical. Especially when no single person was even responsible for the redefinition.

>>16958941
>99% of people credit Black Science Man for having Pluto demoted
I have never in my life heard a single person claim Tyson was, in any way, involved in Pluto's demotion.

>>16952021
yasmin absolutely clowned maidthings into oblivion, maidthings honestly should kill itself, there is no coming back.

>>16952055
>>16956894
People always bring up Jurassic Park, but they literally said in the movie and book that the dinos weren't accurate and had to have gaps filled in with frog dna. The whole point of that movie was they didn't care about the scientific advances, they just wanted money.

>>16952075
>The Pluto thing is because people discovered a bunch of other objects like Pluto and at some point they realized that it's inconsistent to call Pluto a planet but not them.
The reason is Americans discovered those things and the IAU doesn't want Americans to have discovered more planets than Europeans.

[math]\sum_{n=1}^\infty \frac{1}{n^s}[/math]

Test

>>16959733
The Americans you're talking about are just the subset of Europeans who decided they'd rather go sail across an ocean and die in the woods somewhere than play court games with inbred habsburgs. Cream of the crop, really.

>>16959743
Yes, that is what it means to be American.

>>16959005
Makes sense, outside of his PhD research Tyson has very few academic publications, mostly review stuff. Your average physics prof at some state-level uni who has worked in academia as long as the years since Tyson got his PhD probably has more than double his number of publications.

I have nothing against le Black Science Man, and while I appreciate him whenever he speaks of astrophysics, cosmology and quantum mechanics, often it is the case that he keeps yapping about subjects like psychology, evolution, genetics and advanced materials science that he knows jack shit about compared to the expert in said field who’s a guest in his podcast. Man loves to yap.

>>16959745
Essentially it is. That's why the subset of Americans who you could say are indigenous to America at this point, with roots predating FDR, would largely rather be governed by people who shit on political dynasties and don't conform to the politics of palace intrigue than the dynasts who try to bully everyone else with their hypocritical proprieties, whenever that choice is available (or seems to be).