>>7858976
Money

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>https://www.scribd.com/document/608834418/Gitgud-at-Illustration-Guide-for-Anons
>https://prrb.tumblr.com/post/30177790499/shrimp-method
these help me improve, they will help you as well

>>7858976
You are correct, we are lying to keep people drawing boxes forever. The true way to improve is to buy and watch as many courses as you can and NEVER draw.

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Yeah, just draw bro

>>7858976
just draw what you want to get better at instead of falling for scams trying to sell you a shortcut that doesnt exist but instead will end up setting boundaries for you that arent even ones set by yourself

Just draw isn't enough, but it's most of it.

You do need a basic foundation of knowledge, but like 90% of what you need to know is really basic stuff that's in every half decent book, so you only need one.

And when you're just drawing you have to actually apply it.

>>7858976
You can't because you were raised with a smartphone and have permanently gimped your spatial thinking. They did a study and found gen z screen usage has retarded their cognitive development. It's why everyone under 30 can't even draw boxes, why old men like jung gi are so good.

To learn anything, you need to look up how it is done, attempt it and then reflect over why it did or did not work. Repeat until you can do thing.

For drawing this means doing this for a few couple of things. Mainly shapes, perspective and maybe some rendering.

>>7858976

It's kinda' like lifting. Obviously you need to lift regularly in order to get jacked, but if you do it wrong you could end up slowing down your progress at best or hurting yourself at worst. And so you learn how to do things properly from more experienced people and take that with you in your own practice.

>>7859014
t. balding old permabeg

>>7858988
This is genuinely sad... how does this happen?

>>7858988

It's funny because both drawings have almost the exact same proportions and angles, as if he were just trying to literally copy the old drawing instead of reimagine it. I wonder what would happen if he tried to copy a piece of art that was actually good.

>>7859022
infrequent and incurious practice, probably also relatively low iq. You have to actually be thinking to improve.

>>7858976
The jews don't want you to know this but the LESS you draw, the BETTER you get.

Identify one accurate flaw in your drawing and practice ways to improve it.
If you keep doing this and continue to improve your drawings, you will steadily improve.
You won't make much progress if you rely on others to point out what's wrong with your drawing.
Look at many good drawings in order to identify the flaws in the drawings you draw yourself.

>>7859018
As though people on 4chan lift

>>7859046
>You have to actually be thinking to improve.

I'm screwed

>>7859322
The fact that you're scared of stagnating already puts you miles ahead of any of the examples you're scared of. Complacency is a real killer

>>7858976
Jush draw wis the beginnong of gitt gud, not teh and oof tah joenay

>>7859315
so just like in fighting games,in them you watch back the recordings of your gameplay -> identify the issues then go into the lab(training mode) and find ways to correct it

>>7858976
just draw and if you're too retarded to do that, kill yourself. genuinely.

>>7858988
>>7859022
hard to tell, and its not as if they made no progress, but unless you can see a comprehensive body of work from them over time, you couldn't really tell how they actually developed. Additionally, this particular measure doesn't account for other area of competencies, like compositions and technical drawings like background and objects. You don't know how long it takes for them to construct the first figure vs the latter, its possible that they are faster and can do more poses. I couldn't find the person's account so I can't survey the extend of their work, although in general, I feel people who deride the idea underestimated how much people who improves actually draws.

>>7858976
>what do you mean just draw!!!
it means you are wasting time making these threads, you know you are wasting time making these threads, and you know you should be drawing right now.

>>7861908
Why are you not anonymous? Everyone here is called anonymous... yet you don't have that name? Curious...

>>7858976
Not many will tell you this, but the constant barrage of art tutorials and courses and books are no different than the same industrial-complex found within creative writing. Many hobbyists may flirt with an artistic medium, but few will commit to improving on a daily basis or taking it to a professional level. There are WAY too many people who get stuck buying books and watching videos or taking courses because they're in love with the idea of "being an artist" or are afraid to actually push themselves.

Outside of "common sense" stuff, you don't need to engage with most of these videos or books. They will eat up valuable time that is better spent drawing or writing or whatever it is you want to do. In this case, it's drawing, but you musn't "just draw" because you risk falling into stagnation or learning incorrectly.

The "common sense" stuff is the following:

>trace your photo reference
>do lots of contours of your subject
>draw your reference upside down
>break down your reference into shapes
>draw your subject on a glass sheet with a marker
>take your subject/reference, look at it, then take it away and draw it from memory (then draw it while looking at it, then repeat the first step)
>learn how to sculpt or crochet
>start doing origami on a daily basis
>learn a symbol-based language
>draw for 1-2 hours on weekdays, and 5+ hours on the weekends

>>7858976
The youtubers are obviously lying to get views (like most youtube tutorials)

>>7858976
>Draw
>See what you lack or hate about it
>Study it
>Repeat
Don't fall into the Youtube meme, they just repeat the same thing you would see on a book about it, but slower, with missing information and with a retard that doesn't know how to teach.
Same thing with courses, ignore everything made by artists that aren't teachers. And even then, some of them are/became useless because they we're made with receiving feedback from the teacher and he may no longer do it (or not possible in case you pirated it).

Because most people are lazy and retarded. Hope this helps.

>>7858988
youre making a logical leap that they drew for years on end between the two dates but the reality is they most likely drew very little comparatively to other activities

>>7858976
No art journey is the same, everyone is different, but if I had to put it simply:
50% of it is "just draw/paint".
50% is "get good info".

Courses help because you are, hopefully, getting good information that helps you greatly to construct the form, understand anatomy, understand lighting, understand simplification, by a professional artist who is probably smarter than you.

If you grind art without a "guide", and are relatively intelligent, and do put an effort into understanding what you are doing and seeing, you would eventually figure out 90% of what courses teach out simply by grinding drawings and paintings, but it would take many years, probably a decade or more.

Why learning from someone else is great is because they already went through all the grinding, were likely instructed and guided by another teacher, and they figured out their own ways to deconstruct visual representation, that being knowing anatomy really well (Scott Eaton), or constructing from imagination the figure (Krenz), or values colour and paint (any of the painting teachers in NMA, or Marco Bucci), understand gesture intuitively (Vilppu), etc.

Knowing that the average person isn't really that bright, then simply "draw to get good" won't work for most people, they simply won't figure out anything when they still haven't even figured the most essential basic (copying accurately without tracing or guides, just look at the beg threads), how are they going to successfully deconstruct the figure by themselves?

However, someone who simply follows youtube courses, and "learns", without applying any of it and putting in the work, will also not improve.
The average person, who isn't particularly impressive in terms of intellect, will never improve, unless he follows courses (learns from smarter people) and puts in the work (develops the actual skill and mental library, to actually understand how and what is happening in the human figure, light, perspective, etc).

>>7858976
I love thread like these because /ic/ will fear monger these /beg/ to quit the hobby asap and weed out competition

selling shovels something something blah blah

>>7862103
this desu
Most retards will draw once a week for 5 years, and will be surprised that someone who draws everyday for a year outperformed them.

>>7858976
You are too autistic to draw lmao

>>7864995
if you are not smart enough to filter the content and understand it you are not smart enough to draw.

Vilppu and left brain fags a shit, zoomers a shit.

>>7858976
No, you watch youtube videos to get good. That's why there were no good artists until 2013 or so

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>>7865085
Most youtube artists are nodraw frauds.

Modern art is garbage.

Modern artists are garbage.

AI is not the great equalizer that you think it is, it simply cements the older generation as the last great art generation. Nothing more putrid than a modern day "artists".

>>7865091
>Modern artists are garbage.
It's all that damn phone!!!
Back in my day when you had hobby, you would no life in it. Nowadays you are gonna doom scroll, and maybe partake in your hobby afterwards.
Very bad deal for wannabe artists.

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>>7858976
you try to draw the best thing you possibly can. don't just draw heads and boxes. keep trying that best thing.

>>7858976
Do you do math to get good at math?
No you don't. You study.

>>7865101
>Do you do math to get good at math?
>No you don't. You study.
Are you fucking retarded?
The only real way to be good at math is to do math. Studying math is literally doing math.
You wanna learn algebra? You grind algebra problems.
You wanna learn calculus? You grind calculus problems.
You wanna learn proofs? You write proofs.
No wonder so many people have issues with math if you tards go around learning formulas by heart.

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>>7865096
You are actually stupid if you think we are not in a bad state as a society or maybe just completely sheltered from the outside world. Quick reminder that Disney is still seen as the holy grail for a lot of artists and animators.

People simply used to be better and smarter, has nothing to do with time, zoomniggers job all the time against older generations despite being medicated with meth (adderall), they are just stupid people.

>>7865108
To do math you need to understand math, ideas and patterns that requires critical thinking and intelligence, formulas can be memorized and that's something anyone is able to do.

To be a good chess player you need to understand geometry, ideas and patterns which require critical thinking and intelligence. Memorizing lines will only get you so far.

To be a good artists you need to understand planes, depth, ideas and patterns which require critical thinking. If you are left brained RETARD you memorize things and to 5 minute doodles, but you will always be a clown and you know this. No construction, not a real draw.

>>7865116
>To do math you need to understand math, ideas and patterns that requires critical thinking and intelligence, formulas can be memorized and that's something anyone is able to do.
>To be a good chess player you need to understand geometry, ideas and patterns which require critical thinking and intelligence. Memorizing lines will only get you so far.
>To be a good artists you need to understand planes, depth, ideas and patterns which require critical thinking. If you are left brained RETARD you memorize things and to 5 minute doodles, but you will always be a clown and you know this. No construction, not a real draw.
And how do you thing understanding arises? From doing. You do then understand, not the other way around.

>>7865116
dude its the opposite, construction makes up for not being able to draw. If you can draw something directly from your mind or make it up, then you don't need construction.

>>7865315
you are using memory and experience over actual imagination and correct postures / angles. it's lame and it will never allow you to achieve greatness, but let's be honest that's not what you want.

i mean why waste 12 hours when you can do a shitty left sided brain retarded drawing in 5 minutes. Who's even going to notice? Are you even aware of your own capabilities?

>>7865319
construction is how you practice to improve your imagination. But you're acting like a good drawing needs construction used in it. That's not true, if you're constructing then you're studying, so that's not your peak form, you will get better and then draw amazing things WITHOUT construction.

So you are still using construction overall to get better but the actual drawings themselves will look better if you can draw them without using construction due to practice and experience.

>>7865327
>you will get better and then draw amazing things WITHOUT construction.

Maybe your entire workflow is built on fallacy and little effort that to you you can't draw good things without construction? Ever thought of that?

How are you doing to draw a thoracic cage in that exact angle or how much foreshortening something has without constructing it first? Rolling the dice? AI does that better than you can.

You have a left brain and you need to understand this. You have less intelligence than me and right brainers. No need to spew bullshit.

>>7865335
left/right brain is an outdated neurological model. you might as well be talking about your humors being more in balance, it's bunk.

>>7865091
So are these all bad art? What's the point of the attached picture?

>>7858988
These give me enormous anxiety, escalating to a heart attack as the year gap approaches 20 years

If you are good, then drawing will make you good. It just brings out what's in you, but if you are shit, you need to do more.

bumping this thread because there's a link in it that i'll want to click on but i'm noot going to click on it now because i'm procastrinating

careful slow drawing and focused study has never led to a good artist. all good artists intuitively learn by drawing without construction or rigid guidelines.
There are plenty of examples of constructoids that dedicate years to theory but can't draw a paper bag, though.

The actual use for art studies is to make up for not drawing as a kid. If you had been doodling your entire life then you have muscle memory that will take you far and you don't need to do all these gay circles and cubes. Those are for people who literally have never drawn or imagined anything before.