>>64825223
One is gay shit for women while the other is women shit for gays

>>64825223
No practical difference on the target. More rounds with 9mm with a little less recoil. If you’ve got a 40, you’ll be fine and don’t sweat it.

obviously 9mm. if 40 was good professionals would use it.

you are not a strong man in the hard times just because you 'shoot' 40sw

>>64825235
If 9mm was good then why does everyone, including experts, talk shit about it? Checkmate, atheist

File: GX4SudkWgAA9jw6.jpg (689.5 KB)

689.5 KB JPG

>.40 SW is $.28 /round.
>9x19 is $.22 /round
In pistols, shot placement trumps caliber choice by an enormous margin, and you can train 27% at the same cost with 9mm.

>>64825223
Bullet advancement of 9mm made the .40 obsolete.

>>64825241
>everyone, including experts

list a few please.

>>64825256
I keep hearing this, this gotta be a lie, no way.

>>64825223
They're not 10mm, .357 Sig/mag or .45 anything.

>>64825252
A better comparison is defensive ammo, since you should train with your carry ammo
>Speer GD 9mm is 27-31 bucks for 50
>Speer GD 40 is 22-27 bucks for 50
40 wins

>>64825257
Me. I'm an expert and I think 9mm is GAY. Also 40 is gay too, but in a more closeted way. The only heterosexual cartridge that doesn't have penis problems (sorry 38) is 41 Magnum, this is the truth the ghosts of Elmer Keith, Jeff Cooper, and Paul Harrel told me one Christmas night
>>64825261
It is a lie, look up any gel test and 40 still consistently has deeper penetration and wider expansion

>>64825261
It’s based off probably a single type of 9mm ammo matching the performance of a low performing .40 S&W ammo. Mass doesn’t lie, heavier projectiles do better through barriers and flesh

>>64825750
>Mass doesn’t lie, heavier projectiles do better through barriers and flesh
>APFSDS does worse through barriers then a cannon ball guys because it's so light!!!!
lol retard. Energy and sectional density are what do better. And there are zero regular semiauto handgun rounds that have any effects beyond being hole punchers, for which all of them are fine. Forget 9mm, 380 is also not merely just as good as 40sw but BETTER because it's easier to control out of a tiny gun and does the same job at 3-5yd.

The cope fags do about their pet round instead of just admitting the obvious truth that
>yes they're all the same but this one suits my niche use case and preferences
is wild.

File: .png (213.8 KB)

213.8 KB PNG

>>64825223
9mm can be pretty good

I like and shoot both

>>64825790
>And there are zero regular semiauto handgun rounds that have any effects beyond being hole punchers, for which all of them are fine
When will people realize how vastly superior .300BLK loaded with a .327 bullet is to any pistol cartridge, without being any longer than 5.7x28?

File: Ben-Affleck-Grammy-memes-tweets-6-1450312487.jpg (116.6 KB)

116.6 KB JPG

>>64825252
>>9x19 is $.22 /round

>>64825909
How well does it work out a micro compact with like a 2.5"-3.5" barrel?
>it doesn't
vast majority of the market doesn't fucking care then, just like with 5.7x28 which is an ok smg round but mediocre handgun round.

If you don't care about CC and cost and mass market there are a ton of awesome options to play with. But caring about getting tiny/cheap/widespread is precisely what limits the envelope most handgun design has to work with.

>>64825848
That shit becomes just as hard on guns and as hard to control as .40, while also being more expensive per round than .40
Top tier 9mm actually makes the perceived advantages of 9mm, rapidly evaporate.

>>64825275
>A better comparison is defensive ammo, since you should train with your carry ammo
What the fuck fuddlore cope shit is this? You should never train your carry ammo beyond sampling a few boxes a few times a year to make sure it works.
>>64825938
it's only 20cpr or less if your gun is ok with steelcase or you don't mind rolling the dice with reman. 22 is a more reasonable number.

>>64825973
>You should never train your carry ammo beyond sampling a few boxes a few times a year to make sure it works
Yes, and you should never practice drawing and shooting because that's how you hurt yourself, just practice drawing separately from shooting. Also never practice shooting one handed or moving, that's fudd nonsense meant to ruin your groups and splits and make you look like a fool online

>>64825993
>140gr@x FMJ is totally different from 140gr@x HP, physics is subordinate to my feels
>practicing more with cheaper ammo is the same thing as practicing less!! because I'm very mad about people not all getting my snowflake meme caliber!!!!!
You can stop pretending you own guns or practice with them much now anon lol.

>>64825970
thing is, 124gr at 1385ps IS good enough self defense. .40 is obsolete.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrnRKgWd9CY

File: 20260131_222446.jpg (2.8 MB)

2.8 MB JPG

>>64826037
>the only thing that defines a bullets flight path and impact is its mass and velocity
>the concave end on one projectile has no effect on how it flies
Enjoy your award anon, you've outdone yourself

>>64825223
>What’s the verdict?
.40 S&W is basically 9mm +p+ and wears out the guns chambered in it like a +p+ gun would. It also has excellent terminal performance at the cost of more recoil.

>>64825959
>micro compact
Well there's your're are problem. It'll do just fine out of a 5" service barrel.

>>64826177
It does even better out of an 8.5" barrel
I've shot 90gr XTPs to 2400fps out of one. I 3d printed some magazines and a magwell adapter to test them out. 300blk is a hell of a pdw cartridge with pistol bullets

>>64825261
Having a 9mm that can pass barriers and still penetrate to the necessary depth while having more capacity and easier for the median of users to control is why .40 is no longer being adopted in service capacity.

>>64826253
For your purposes it as good as FMJ then

9 40 45

I'll take 357 SIG

>>64826072
>can't into fluid mechanics

>>64825223
The difference in autoloading ballistics is so miniscule that magdumping is the only real way to measure effect on target. In which case, the easier to control 9mm is the better option.

>>64825231
spbp
If you want something hotter than 9mm, 10mm Auto is the next actually useful step up.

Idk man. shoot some niggers with both calibers and tell us the results.

the world is full of living shooting targets that going to the range seems a waste of time.

>>64825223
People say a lot of dumb shit when it comes to this round vs that round. Some of them think they are sailing profound things. Like "placement trumps caliber". It's profoundly retarded and they don't even realize.
9mm vs 40 when viewing the terminal results is a very obvious win.for 40sw.

>>64826072
you may be hasguns but you are thoroughly outing yourself as a retard here at the same time

40sw kicks annoyingly and it makes followup shots much harder than 9mm. people who use superficial ways of displaying their masculinity will say "lift more" while their leo-trade in glock fowty sits under the bed, unused.

I'm going to load 115gr FMJ into my gen3 glonk clone and nobody can stop me.

>>64825275
I train with cheap remanufactured garbage 9mm ammo and I shoot defensively with cheap remanufactured garbage 9mm ammo. What now?

>>64826931
Who cares? I'm armed which means my argument is better than yours since I can kill you for disagreeing. That's like the 3rd rule of debate according to debate club. Until someone puts a pistol in a vice and shoots equal weight FMJ and JHP to demonstrate there's a negligible change in POI I will live believing the intuitive thought that changing the nose geometry of a projectile changes its flight characteristics

>>64826293
>9 40 45
>I'll take 357 SIG
The thing is that, IMO, .40 S&W and .357 SIG are blaster cartridges that work best in a full-sized pistol with a long barrel. Since OP wants a micro compact, his best option is 9mm.

.380 is what real /k/ommandos use for family defense.
>same radius of a 9mm so the same wound channel profile
>no over penetration so you don't hit your family behind the target
>no cover penetration so you don't kill your family in the next room
>a lot less powder so you can shoot it indoors without turning you and your family deaf
>almost zero recoil so you can magdump with perfect precision and no cycle jams - perfect for CQB

>>64827830
>real /k/ommandos
>having a family
Lol, lmao even. A real /k/ommando will use the biggest, most powerful gun he has to hand loaded with at the very least tracers if not incendiaries or HE. Personally my HD gun is a bit lacking, I only have dragonbuck loaded in my saiga drum

>>64825223
>9mm vs 40 s&w
to match 40sw 9mm needs to be 147 grain and +p. If you a cop on the bad streets and need every extra round you can get then 9mm has a slight advantage. For home or personal defense get the less expensive gun and less expensive ammo and some extra mags.

>Guys, what bullet that do the thing almost identically to the other thing will do more killing better?
Ad nauseam, repeat for decades. The real answer is: use a rifle round if you're worried about it

File: 1760096968218104.png (115.1 KB)

115.1 KB PNG

>>64825223
.45

I shoot .40 through my 10mm guns as cheaper training so for me I stack tons of .40 and 10mm and I have a ton of cheap glocks I got in 40cal that I can easily convert to 9mm if I ever decide to... so it works pretty well for me

>>64825223
Bullet design was the issue. Either accept hot/range fairy loads in 10, or proceed straight to either 357 SIG or 45 GAP. 9 was fine ultimately. 5.7 also arrived too late.

>>64825223
As DEI entered the workplace, so did more women and effeminate men. Women couldn't qualify with the .40 so they came up with the lie of "better bullet performance" to explain the change. Its really that simple. All you have to do is watch police bodycam videos on YouTube to see peeps routinely taking half a dozen shots from 9mm and walking it off. Real .40 gets near 357 magnum performance.

>>64826628
5.7

>>64827220
> I will live believing the intuitive thought that changing the nose geometry of a projectile changes its flight characteristics
that's not intuitive at all. why would you think it would effect things in any meaningful way within the distances a handgun is meant to be used? please help me understand your thought process.

>>64825223
The USP comes in both so I'm good with either.

>>64828652
>thought process
You think someone who carries a .40 Shield with a airsoft-grade laser/light unit in 2026 has a thought process?

>>64828652
>how does changing the leading end of a projectile change its flight characteristics?
You know anon you're right, the nose means nothing and planes should have the face of a freight train so long as they can maintain the same mass and velocity
>>64828689
Are you blind? It's a 9mm shield. I'm not even batting for 40, but saying you only need to shoot your carry ammo a few times a year is pants on head retarded. Obviously you should at least shoot your carry ammo once per range trip if not more. Even if you think the POI shift from FMJ to JHP is negligible, they dont make +p FMJ which means you're not practicing the recoil impulse of your particular carry round of choice. Also, and this is really sad for streamlight, that airshit-tier light is leaps and bounds better than the TLR-6 I had before. What's even worse is that it's survived being thrown and a kayaking trip, it's actually kinda good and I hate saying that

File: IMG_2546.jpg (629.1 KB)

629.1 KB JPG

>>64825223
I carried one for many years, my former dept had great results when shooting bad guys. I carry my 9mm Steyr now but I love the cheap PD trade guns and ammo.

File: e9mmb2p-m17-50-web-large-1.jpg (76.5 KB)

76.5 KB JPG

>>64828906
>the nose means nothing and planes should have the face of a freight train so long as they can maintain the same mass and velocity
are you doing a bit or are you actually so dense that you're comparing fluid dynamics of a bullet within 0-25m to streamlining for distance travel? this is a serious question, i need to know if i'm speaking to a genuine moron or just a shitter.
>Even if you think the POI shift from FMJ to JHP is negligible
anon, it is. it is negligible. that you think it would be otherwise is honestly kind of distressing.
>they dont make +p FMJ
oh my god dude

>>64829361
Huh, you know I have never once seen that before in my life, I stand corrected. Still won't stop me practicing with gold dots and stressing over everything

File: 1365741512907.jpg (48.1 KB)

48.1 KB JPG

>>64827220
Anon you are a fucking dolt. Like, I'm not saying that to just get a rise out of you, I'm commenting that you are an actual nitwit. I get the same POI with my Speer Gold Dots as I do my Blazer plinking ammo. This isn't long range precision shooting, these are carry handguns. They're being used <25y and, in a defensive situation, almost guaranteed <10y. Tell me why on God's green earth you think a JHP is going to have any real impact on POI vs a FMJ here? Like, how did you even consider this a possibility, while still deeming yourself suitable for firearm ownership?

do you guys still lose sleep about this?

if you cant hit groups of 3" with less than 3 seconds between shots at 20ft then caliber DOESNT matter

>>64829374
>Still won't stop me practicing with gold dots and stressing over everything
why, though? seriously, why? the whole point of this ammo is to be cheap while still replicating the feel of the hotter defensive loads. they are specifically meant for people like you who go all in on "train with your carry ammo." it's right there. you can buy it considerably cheaper and shoot more. what are you stressing out over, anyways?

>>64829473
>what are you stressing out over, anyways?
A lot of things anon, the economy, the state of Somaliland, the future for car interiors, when will the constant companions LP finally release, the inevitable deaths of all who I hold dear, the fact I still suck at saxophone

>>64829506
interesting, i hope things get better for you.

>>64828906
>>64826321

>>64828479
Based

big bullet more better

>>64825223
It doesn‘t matter

Bigger bullet = better.
9mm < .40 < .45
Nuff' said

>>64825241
>experts
Funny way of spelling "couple of retards."

>>64827409
>10 mm Auto and .357 SIG are blaster
ftfy

.40 S&W can be fired in a subcompact designed for the cartridge (the P2000SK being one of the select few available) but yes generally it should be used in a 3.5-inch or longer barrel to take full advatage of the round's energy. Compacts and full size pistols are best for the .40

>>64836072
>.40 S&W
By having less powder than a full-power 10mm, it needs the barrel length even more than 10mm does. Just because subcompacts for it exist doesn't mean they are are great. By that logic 10mm is great for subcompacts as the Glock 29 SF exists.
>it should be used in a 3.5-inch or longer barrel to take full advatage of the round's energy.
Did you miss the part where OP wants a subcompact?

>>64825223
for me 9mm is king
I stopped considering other cartridges when I realized I can fit 18 hollow point rounds into my 9mm full-size on a standard mag

>>64836072
357 sig expanding bullets do not penetrate any more than the 9mm counterparts. What do you think you are gaining? The fluted bullets all just make 9mm holes in live tissues. 357 sig and 9mm +p+ are the same thing. Any added velocity for the sig is spent on impact overcoming the increased resistance due to velocity.
357 sig is an exercise in not understanding how terminal ballistics works. These "regular" pistol rounds do not in any meaningful waysurpass the stretch resistance of human tissues outside the caliber sized hole they leave.
Energy transfer is like hitting a steel plate with a sledgehammer. Energy changes, transfers and travels. Pistol bullets do not carry enough to do anything meaningful. Momentum is like driving a pick axe through sheet metal. Momentum overcomes the resistance. Momentum is king in pistol and dg rifles. It's really that simple. Doesn't sell new guns and bullets though.

File: 1652058756549.gif (3.1 MB)

3.1 MB GIF

>>64827830
>real /k/ommandos will use .380
Fucking lmao, they would use a fucking civil war cannon if they got the option. Collateral damage, what's that?

>>64836072
>Compacts and full size pistols are best for the .40

nigga you just own a USP compact in .40 because it was 300 dollars cheaper than a 9mm USP

>>64825291
>The only heterosexual cartridge that doesn't have penis problems (sorry 38) is 41 Magnum
holy based