>>23713546
>best show
>shit pacing
>villain of the week to push toys
>overuse of stock animation
>shitty characters introduced and immediately dropped without satisfying arcs
yeah bro, it was so good it almost got canceled
the best gundam show is 80, followed by z then 83

>>23713562
>villain of the week to push toys
Clover never had any interest in producing 'bad guy' toys, because they didn't think kids would ever want them.

>>23713566
Sure that's why they didn't produce nor sell them
Oh wait

>>23713567
>that's why they didn't produce nor sell them
Right, they didn't. They only made toys for the Gundam, Guncannon, Guntank, White Base, and finally the G-Armour (which was actually added to the series at their insistence to try and buoy sales in the latter half). They didn't even make a Zaku toy.

>>23713566
Tomino says otherwise.

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>>23713643
Tomino himself did the initial sketches for most of the weird looking MSs and MAs in the back half of the series, because the Clover had no plans for commercialising them so he and Okawara could just do what they wanted rather than have to jointly design it as a toy.
It's a point that's come up in a few interviews with Okawara, e.g. here https://www.oricon.co.jp/special/52754/2/
>あの頃は、メインのロボットさえ決まればスポンサーは何も言わなかった。それに“敵を売る・売れる”という時代でもないんですね。富野さんからは「モノアイだけは守ってくれ」という指示はありましたが、基本的にジオン軍は自由にやらせてもらいました。
>当たり前の話ですが、主役ロボットはスポンサーや会社の意向だったり、いろんな人の意見が入ってくるので、デザイナーとしては大変な面も多かった(笑)。だから、「もっとカッコイイものを作ってやる」っていう反骨精神から生まれたのがザクなんです。

>>23713562
>>shit pacing
You're a TikTok alpha gen kid
>>villain of the week to push toys
Good
>>overuse of stock animation
Budget and staff issues
>>shitty characters introduced and immediately dropped without satisfying arcs
Real war stuff

>>23713562
you just described zeta

>>23713546
Except its sequels had better plots, characters, animation, mechanical designs and were better overall.

>>23713562
>to push toys
The first gundam toys weren't released until after the series' run was over.

>>23713546
Zeta > 0079
Grendizer > Mazinger Z

>>23713831
That's not true. The sales figures didn't come back until after it ended though. Xabungle's toys didn't come out until after the show ended but that's just Clover being shit after Trider G7 made them super happy.

>>23713834
no
absolutely not

>>23713546
Not only is this not true, I actually can't think of a single franchise where this applies except Code Geass

>>23713779
None of this is true btw

>>23714092
>implying there was no animation improvement since 79
come on now

>>23713562
no Gundam show has better pacing.

>>23714199
Zeta had worse animation and looked incredibly amateurish overall

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>>23714289
>Zeta had worse animation

>>23714289
I see, since we cant have a good faith discussion Ill just take my leave

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>>23714289
>Zeta had worse animation

You faggots are just mad because he is right. 0079 had more fluid animation in fight sequences and also more complex and dynamic choreography in said fight sequences, the show just has a more out-dated artstyle compared to Zeta. Specifically the first Amuro fight against Ramba Ral, and basically every fight sequence after Amuro realises he is a newtype, these sequences are all much better animated than anything in Zeta. Zeta is actually very poorly animated for an 80s anime, Ideon, Xabungle, Dunbine, and L-Gaim have much better animation and that's not including other non-Tomino stuff. Layzner for example has OVA quality animation in the second half which completely shits on Zeta. In comparison, having watched a lot of 70s anime, 0079 is maybe slightly better than average but still has better animation than Zeta, which looked bad even for its time.
>inb4 ZZfag
ZZ has slightly better animation but still has dogshit choreography, I am not going to defend ZZ.
>inb4 the off-model shots of the rx-78
Zeta has off-model shots that are just as bad, nor is that a serious critique of the animation. Most of those off-model shots are in-between frames that the eye would hardly notice anyway as they just convey motion in a more fluid way.

>>23714536
>>23715081
>>23715089
Post an example of Zeta not looking mediocre to terrible. There are maybe 3 episodes out of 50.

>>23715556
>Ideon, Xabungle, Dunbine, and L-Gaim have much better animation
Those all look like shit too especially L-Gaim

Cause sequels and AU's are headcanons and fan-fiction. 0079 is the only actual "canon" in Gundam.

>>23716228
You can argue whatever you want for the rest but Xabungle has consistently fluid animation and looks a million times better than Zeta. The others are more up and down, Ideon has some cheap moments but it also is generally a better animated show than 0079 as well. Regardless, Zeta is a massive step down in quality.

>>23716227
There are nicely animated scenes from Zeta to be fair but they also have shit choreography so it's much less impressive, every space fight is stiff and boring compared to what you see in 0079.

>>23716244
Which 0079?

>>23716297
The novels

>>23716297
Movie trilogy

>>23714289
>>23716227
>>23716287
Zetaranger detected.

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>>23713546
Gundam is the Star Wars of Japan.
I think Tomino and everyone involved had something to prove and they got the right team together to prove it, ala George Lucas. Absolute “lightning in a bottle” scenario that won’t ever happen again.

Gundam 0079 is greater than the sum of its parts. It’s a space opera and military drama that took itself and its story seriously without many corporate restraints other than “sell hero toys”. Its overall message of universal consciousness and empathy is easily digestible and presented cleverly. It’s beyond even the medium it’s presented in (a cartoon). It has clear cut heroes and villains but also makes them nuanced without being preachy.
The machines silhouettes stick in the mind.
It’s a 70s version of an ideal future brought to the brink by the same revolutions that cause wars today.

I think it was the exact right time of release to have the best possible influences.
Star Wars and Star Trek were in their absolute prime and Tomino wanted the “super robot” to mature. He borrowed bits and pieces from western and eastern science fiction, exactly as George Lucas did at a similar time.

Everything after 0079 becomes derivative to a fault and/or corporatized, the same fate as Star Wars and Star Trek.

Gundam 0079 was financed on the basis it would sell toys, but that wasn’t the prime motivation for why it was handled with tender love and care. It was pure autism and experimentation.

I personally don’t believe anything will capture the same visual and narrative spectacle of the original Gundam series in the “real robot” genre. It really is the “Star Wars Original Trilogy” of Japan.

That’s why it’s the best. Everything else within the franchise trying to extrapolate upon it well can be seen as a bonus. Everything else is strictly a toy commercial.

For people who genuinely think Zeta is better…. It isn’t.

I'm on episode 24 right now.
Became kind of a slog after Garma died .
Also, I think M'Quve's name is probably supposed to be translated as "McVeigh".

>>23716803
CCA is better
also,
>muh lucas
>muh fag wars
>muh took itself seriously
>muh cartoon
>muh toy commercialization
>muh real/super robot
holy shit, so many strikes.
it's fucking 2026, you don't need to be so ill-informed about the genre.

>>23716809
I know what country Zeon should drop the colony on.
Only issue is that it won’t exist by 0079 let alone 0001.

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>>23716806
Nah, on the episode title cards it's rendered as 'Ma Kube' (マ・クベ, with the nakaguro in the middle), rather than as one name. Hell, in the compilation movie credits he's just called 'Ma'

>>23716809
>CCA is better
It really isn't. The movie needed an extra 30 minutes of run time to actually develop characters. As it stands, CCA is just kind of underbaked.

>>23714289
>>23715556
>>23716227
>>23716287
Obvious samefag is obvious

>>23716858
It really is. 0079 had poor animation, poor character designs and development, poor mechanical designs, poor pacing...

>>23716910
What was actually wrong with them?

23716910
>poor development
>poor character design
>poor pacing
>poor mecha
You're not a serious person and I'm only replying to prevent some noob from seeing it and thinking it's a valid opinion.

>>23715556
>>23716803
You're just one really delusional retard, aren't you

>>23716916
>implying you're not replying to yourself
nice try, op

>>23716803
>Gundam is the Star Wars of Japan.
So you're saying that Gundam is overrated shit?

>>23716244
Wrong, the actual canon in Gundam is every animated work directed by Tomino.

0079 has legendary animation and you can find countless animators mentioning how it influenced them. You won't find a single person say this about Zeta. Zeta was never good. Deal with it, Zetafags.

>>23716981
Whatever you say, OP.

CCA is bad, Tomino didn't know how to write a movie.

>>23719108
>CCA is bad
What do you mean, there are cool robots fighting and everything

>>23713569
Clover made toys of some of the enemy suits but they were cheaper sofubi figures only

>>23715556
Don’t bother, all the retards here think more shading=better animation

>>23716809
CCA is fucking dogshit even F91 is better

>>23716901
You are a retard.

>>23716923
The "Star Wars" faggot isn't me and for the record I think that person is completely wrong and utterly moronic.

>>23716596
I am by no means a Zetarager. I think it's mediocre but I actually enjoy the first half of the series a lot, it has a frantic energy to it with good pacing, it advances the setting in an interesting way, and it has a lot of great moments. I particularly like the Hong Kong arc. However the fact remains that the quality of the animation is inferior to 0079 and the fight sequences have worse choreography. They aren't unwatchable but they are a serious step down, which is pretty damning considering the advances in animation since 1979. Layzner basically was like OVA quality on TV.

>>23719370
You sound stressed.

>>23719375
Have you got a real argument or are you upset that I used a few mean words to dismiss idiotic posts that did nothing to address my point?
It's sad how I've had this argument before and the quality of this board has decreased so much that no-one is even trying to argue, they are just trying to dismiss everything in one word by evoking some boogeyman who hasn't been on /m/ in years, accusing obviously at least two different people of being a samefag, and then trying to accuse people of being "mad" as if that means their argument is wrong. At least the guy I was arguing with last time went on Sakugabooru and found a few cherry-picked clips of Zeta looking good, even though it still had terrible fight choreography.
Can any of you worthless spastics make an argument in earnest, at least one? Or is this board truly dead?

>>23719394
Dunno brah I'm just a bot mining crypto

>>23719482
how is the crypto mining business doing?

>>23713546
It's not though, not even top ten, you're thinking of Kamen Rider.

>>23723016
this

>>23716596
>Zetaranger

>>23713546
The best Macross is 7 though.

Is this true with Getter Robo?

>>23713562
You say this as if Gundam wasn't made to push toys. Brainlet take

>>23713546
Tomino said the staff did everything in their power to tell the best self-contained war drama story possible. They wrote 0079 as if it would never receive any sequel animes. This is why 0079 is the best of all Tomino animes, and the best of the Tomino trilogy (0079, Zeta, and CCA).

Tomino himself said the staff were always trying to chase the perfection of the original 0079 anime. They felt later Gundam anime could never quite measure up despite their best efforts. 0079 was always Number 1 in their minds.


Later anime made after 0079 were made with much more toy sales in mind, and therefore influenced the story greatly. Tomino received more restrictions such as not being allowed to kill certain characters, not being allowed have certain characters get married, and requirements on what episodes the Gundam was required to make an appearance. Tomino's creativity was limited by the executives in charge. Every new series imposed more restrictions which made it much harder to just tell a good story.

That's why 0079 is the best.

The original is always the best. And this applies to everything

>>23733699
No.

>>23713562
Honestly, this describes Zeta more than anything.

>>23713546
Several reasons but two I can think of:

1. Success of the first series attracts unwanted interest from management who try to exert more control over the content of the show than they did previously. They do this to broaden appeal and maximize marketability of the show.

2. Showrunners feel pressure to one-up themselves and often go way overboard to accomplish this.

>>23736333
this

>>23716806
Just finished it. It got really good at the end, though I think some characters like Lalah should have been fleshed out more.
Feels like the really good stuff got squeezed into the last episodes.
Might watch Char's Counterattack later, and maybe check out 0083.
>>23715556
One problem with the animation in 0079 is that you can blatantly see the artifacts when the ships are flying in space.