This shit has to just a misunderstanding in the English, right? There's no way people can actually have this "condition." That's really creepy to think about if someone actually had "Aphantasia." That's like a horror movie plot to me. I hope you just misunderstand the idea of the image, OP. Lol.

How can a 2 or 3 get closer to 1?

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>>16898608
I'm not misunderstanding anything. How could I be. There's a big difference between "seeing nothing" and "seeing an apple", isn't there?
>>16898612
Supposedly with this same "Image Streaming" technique for training your imagination. You could try it and see if it works.

>>16898608
No, it's a real condition where people can't visualize an apple but instead have an inner monologue describing an apple. And that is precisely where the inner-monologue counter-meme came from: NPCs who can't visualize an apple and who believe all thinking requires some slow-ass inner monologue.

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Friendly remainder: if you close your eyes and see things actually very clearly jsou are actually borderline psychotic lol

It happens to drug addicts in withdrawals

I wouldn't brag about it

>>16898484
I don't think so, I have it, I hypothesized that the part of your brain that is responsible for 3 dimensional visualization is severely underdeveloped in those with aphantasia, nothing you can do about it, that's my opinion.

Start taking psychedelics like 2CB, shrooms, LSD, ketamine, etc

>>16898484
visualizing is just fake remembering
try this:
- look at a gif of a rotating cube
- look away and remember the gif
- imagine the gif playing backwards
tadaa you visualized something

>>16898484
Anything other than 1 means you are not human and you were probably genetically engineered in a lab and your parents aren't your parents. Lol.

4 is unironically ascended, he accesses the core of cognition, can abstract
5 is drooling retard, non human
1 is a fucking npc retard that "thinks" on realistic terms, terrible for actual creative work, probably memory of a particular apple than actual reconstructing a chain of impressions on an object
2 and 3 are mid

>>16898766
Aphantasia has nothing to do with a lack of inner monologue. They're different things. Also, I don't need an inner monologue to know that I am "thinking" about an apple, even though I can't see it at all. It's hard to explain, but it's like I'm seeing it but not really, you know?
>>16898771
I can handle 3d thinking pretty well, even without actually seeing stuff. There are separate parts of the brain for "visual intelligence" and for actually projecting things to your "mind's eye":
>For example, spatial imagery abilities remain largely intact despite absent visual object imagery, with aphantasics performing as well as controls on spatial imagery questionnaires and mental rotation tasks (Dawes et al., 2022; Keogh and Pearson, 2018; Azañón et al., 2025)
>>16898962
There's nothing stopping a 5 from also thinking symbolically, though.

>>16898768
Idk, it sounds like a pretty cool ability to have, don't you think?
>>16898935
Unfortunately shrooms did nothing for me. The only times I can ever see things is when I'm almost falling asleep and have those hypnagogic flashes. Maybe a good thing to do is to start from there, I guess.
>>16898937
Well, I can imagine the gif, but it looks like [math]\lim_{vividness \to 0} cube[/math], which is not very fun.
>>16898948
What if you met someone with a "mind's ear"? Or a "mind's nose"? Someone who could do a full-dive VR daydream anytime they wanted? Who knows, given that something as basic as aphantasia has only been known for a decade, there might be a lot of people who can do that around.

>>16898994
>not very fun
how fun was your first complex integral? you're learning a new skill, anon

>>16898484
i don't know shit, but it's probably like dreaming. some neurotransmitter maybe. eat some meat or get some exercise or somesuch

>>16898608
>This shit has to just a misunderstanding in the English, right?
That's what I believe. Just a failure to understand the concept as described.

>>16898766
>e but instead have an inner monologue describing an apple
I think you're conflating memes. The "NPC" meme came about from the accusation that "some people DON'T have an inner monologue". It's not a binary "either you see an apple or you hear an apple" thing.

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I don’t agree that we all visualize things the same way within the headspace, but I have seen that there are a lot of people out there that somehow got the idea that it's "normal" to be able to fully see imagined objects, just like they're real, and anything else is "aphantasia". It's really, truly not.

>>16899040
>a lot of people out there that somehow got the idea
yes, i'll bet you could tell people that there is a certain percentage of people that can imagine an apple and one appears in their hand. some would believe and spend their life attempting apple manifestations

>>16898484
>Scientifically speaking, is it possible to cure aphantasia?
Depending on how bad it is, you can improve it by learning to look at things in a meditative way. As in, really letting a sight soak in. Taking in all the details. Noticing the shapes and outlines and proportions, the contrasts and the colors. Take an object so familiar that its sight barely even registers and look at it until you're struck by the way it looks, like you've never seen it before. And learn how to draw. People can't see with their mind's eye because they simply can't see.

>>16898608
This poster has moderate aphantasia, 100%.

>>16898985
>>16899035
That's what I originally thought, but I kid you not, tell one of the "muh inner monologue" spergs that you don't need an inner monologue for everything, that sometimes you conceptualize visually instead of plodding along with mental verbalization, and watch what the majority of them say. They describe their inner experience exactly the same way that people with aphantasia describe theirs, and they scoff at exactly the same things.

I have had excessive visualizations, consider yourself fortunate OP.

>>16898608
Have you considered that some people do *see* an apple, and that you actually have aphantasia?

>>16898994
>What if you met someone with a "mind's ear"?
Surely this is just an inner monologue. For me what made me think I might have aphantasia is that someone made the analogy that visualization is to seeing as inner monologue is to hearing. Whatever my brain is doing when it does a shape rotating task is much less similar to seeing as my inner monologue is to hearing.

Its like having a gpu thats not connected to a monitor, its doing all the calculations but you aren't getting the output visually.

>>16899265
The problem is there isn't a tradition of passing the alternatives along. Your visualization capacity is equivalent to a toddler struggling to invent his own language.

I have an inner monologue as well as the ability to visualise vividly.

Bow before me, peasants.

>>16898608
I did not know this was a thing. I am a 5 I don't see shit but I can think of an apple in 3D with its properties but I do not see it.

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>>16898962
>4 is unironically ascended
Ascended would be all 5 in one person, each defined on their own conceptual abstraction. 1 being actual real life dxample, 4 being abstracted without further definitions (no color, size, etc), and 5 being aural pattern, body's motion in communicating it, how others react to said anstraction, etc, and not even "an apple" anymore".

>>16898994
>The only times I can ever see things is when I'm almost falling asleep and have those hypnagogic flashes.
Then learn to lucid dream, practice, and develop your visualization skills then.

>>16899040
>>16899051
Most humans are retarded sheep and this shit is proof that the masses are very easy to fool and manipulate. Slave theory as proposed by the Greeks is real. Some are just meant to be, well, “slaves”, even if they aren’t slaves. They are incapable of divergent critical think. They don’t own their own thoughts.

>>16898608
Only the people between 2 and 4 seem weird to me. I can perfectly understand someone without a mind's eye, we can lack all sorts of mental functions. But if you're able to imagine anything at all, then how are you not able to add detail to it? It's just doing the exact same process, like you can imagine a tree and you can imagine a leaf but you can't imagine a tree with leaves? What?

>>16900245
imagine it like normal vision
some people have better than 20/20, some have 20/20, others can see decently, others only see blurry blobs and shapes, and some are fully blind

>>16898608
It's all 100% based on self-reporting and is probably the easiest neurological "problem" to fake. Absolutely impossible to know if it is even a real condition.

>>16900254
I get that but the issue is the mechanics of how it would happen. The fuck is up with your hippocampus-cortex link that you can imagine a toy-like apple in a homogenous red color but not one that's got high resolution textures and antialiasing? I have astigmatism and I understand that it's because of a misalignment in my ocular structure.

>>16898484
What do you see when you've got your eyes wide open? The world infront of you. The computer screen, your fingers moving to type responses. The table infront of you. The light source in your room, your phone on the side, etc.

This is the image the brain invents for you when your eyes are wide open. When the eyes are closed, the brain can utilize/recycle the image generation function to generate dreams subconsciously while asleep. It can also be used proactively by "imagining" things. Its just the brain visual system being rerouted. Schizos also have something wrong with their visual controls where imaginations flood the normal waking eyes wide open conscious moment.

There are visualization meditations that exists to master this visual control system. Strong enough meditators can create Tulpas, fake imaginary persons as a training method to understand why our minds hold on to things.

>>16898484
You're just confused about what it means to "visualize" something. It doesn't mean you hallucinate an apple, it basically means this:
> but it's like I'm seeing it but not really, you know?
You don't have this imaginary condition.

>>16900259
obviously the brain is a lot more complicated than aligning two orbs to point at roughly the same point

Visualisation seems to me like one of the most self-evident things so if someone manages to misunderstand that there's *something* going on there, at least

>>16898484
Forget 5, I have no idea how 2-4 can exist.

>>16900239
>retarded sheep
maybe something like ants or bees, with assigned birth roles. fly in the ointment is "status", an imaginary thing which totally fucks up the assignments

>>16900261
Or maybe you do

you cant cure it lmao

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I am visualizing a person walking around planting apple seeds everywhere, grabbing seeds from a pouch and planting them in empty fertile fields, growing free food for the world.
The tree is sprouting from the seed, heading towards sunlight through the soil...at the same time our apple champion is moving on to plant more seed in farther lands...
The seedling is now a tree sapling, growing to branch off through fractal magnetic emergent motions and forces, the first branch...and the first leaf.
Photosynthesis...engaged!
Mixing the crystals, minerals, metals, elements together mined through the root grinders, add water, add sunlight...energize!
More growth, more branches, more leafs...more sunlight collectors and soil miner roots
The first apple!
It is bright fire engine red with light reflections from the afternoon sun
No spots, no worms...a good apple.
A deer reaches up and eats it.
YUM!
The deer will now travel, plant the seeds in a fertilized scat pile, and spread the apples...

I see you also....I visualize you as a fox...sour..grape less...apple less.....and angry because you cannot visualize anything except darkness....darkness....
You are the NPC...I am the story creator....
You exist in my universe....

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>>16900239
>Slave theory as proposed by the Greeks is real.
>Some are just meant to be, well, “slaves”, even if they aren’t slaves.
>They don’t own their own thoughts.
How poetic

>>16898484
>>16900239

2020 proved the NPC hypothesis. And the fact that no one cares is even further proof since, as 2020 revealed, the overwhelming majority are NPCs. Thank you for your attention to this matter.

>>16900259
The issue is more like, when I try to add details, I have to focus on that detail, and the overall picture loses details that I'm not focusing on.

>>16900259
>The fuck is up with your hippocampus-cortex link that you can imagine a toy-like apple in a homogenous red color but not one that's got high resolution textures and antialiasing?
Nothing. This illustration is almost meaningless. People with a weak imagination are unable to resolve some details and features in their mental imagery. What the picture shows is a definite, resolved absence of those features. It's impossible to actually depict aphantasia.

>>16900239
>>16900690
I like to think that it’s possible to break a sheep out of their condition. But it takes a very rude sort of awakening. To get them to jump the fence.

>>16900261
>You're just confused about what it means to "visualize" something. It doesn't mean you hallucinate an apple
You're confused about what it means to visualize something. There's an incredibly consistent, recurring pattern with moderate aphantasics talking exactly like you are trying to correct some "misconceptions". A lot of them will also boast exceptional visualization abilities. But when you examine them objectively, their mental imagery is almost absent, they just have some abstract impression of having mental imagery and they're convinced that's what mental imagery is.

>>16900690
protagonism is the worst mental illness that ever appeared on this planet though

>>16901138
Main character syndrome? It coincides with NPCs. Pay attention to all the libtards throwing themselves in front of ICE cars. They’re perfectly fine martyring themselves. They’re very, eerily similar to Muslims/Arabs.

>>16901138
Objectively, it's precisely failing to see yourself as the protagonist that's associated with a whole array of crippling mental illnesses. This is true both on an individual and a cultural level. The disease is usually so severe the host is removed from the gene pool, so it's basically on par with being born with a micropenis.

>>16900926
Exactly! I have the same issue! Its like my brain decomposes objects into more rudimentary shapes and concepts and then tries to assemble it together but "runs out" of memory halfway through leading to overflow and loss of detail. I can see a "high polygon" object as a fuzzy and smooth thing but to add details I have to focus and reallocate memory leading to loss of detail when panning out. My imagination is largely monochromatic and it takes great focus to see a tint of color. It is also very volitile and disintegrates spontaneously.


Ocassionally I have vivid dreams where I can see color and lighting. These dreams make me very ecstatic, alive and most importantly sapient/human. I envy people who can do this on the fly, and I am downright jealous of those who have hyperphantasia. It has been a major insecurity for me ever since I found out that I have it.

>>16901147
>"runs out" of memory
>leading to overflow
>I can see a "high polygon"
>reallocate memory
>Ocassionally I have vivid dreams where I can see color and lighting. These dreams make me very ecstatic, alive and most importantly sapient/human.
Holy kek. First time I see someone who talks about minds in computer terms come to the correct realization that he must be something less than human.

>>16901147
Cont...

My reference frame is myself. I don't know if they are vivid by average standards. I had this dream a while ago so my memory of it is a bit dull, however, I do remember my reaction to it. I was elated and felt like I saw something. Most people with aphantasia don't care about this 'disorder' as much as I do. Thid maybe because of the fact that their faculties for internal visual imagery may be completely nonexist and they reason abstractly or internally monologue. I am capable of both but inferior compared to the average person. Can't help but feel like I have a mental defect. FML. Would chop ma dick off for a cure.

>>16898484
I asked the same question on /x and an anon gave this answer verbatim:
> There are ways to brute force conquer aphantasia.
Force your neurons to crosswire feelings and internal thoughts into geometric patterns and shapes, is a starter.
If you're under the age of 25 this is easier, if you are over 25, this is really tough without a daily supplement to help reinforce your neural pathways, something like Neuriva Memory 3D .
Anyway, so what you'll want to do, is force a cross association using multiple parts of your brain simultaneously.
Get a type of hard candy you don't normally buy, like hard cinnamons, or peppermints.
Get some music you don't normally listen to, but are willing to tolerate.
Then get an open space.
Start with a simple shape like a square.
Put on the music, load up the hard candy. (You just engaged olfactory, auditory, on neural pathways you don't normally use.)
Then, with your eyes closed imagine a square, then physically move, and walk the outline of the square IRL.
You are forcing the association of the neuromotor feedback of a square shape, into your internal thought capability, by greasing the wheels with the olfactory and auditory pathways getting traffic.
You will force new neural connections for this.
Do it once a day for 21 days.
You will then, be able to "feel" a square with what feels like a new sense internally.
Once you have that, you can move on to a 3D box from it, by trying to manipulate the square in your mind, while moving your hands IRL with your eyes closed, change the music or the candy for this.
The concept of a box is close to a square, but not the exact same. So change one variable, and then try to manipulate a simple box in your mind with your hands, while your eyes are closed.
Once a day, 21 days.
Then move on to circles, spheres, triangles, and prisms.
Once you've done all that, a full internal visualization world, should be possible.
This is the technical and pragmatic method to cure aphantasia.

>>16901164
I copied and pasted from my phone forgot to make everything green but everything below is also the answer they gave. Strangely also told us they wouldn’t advise doing it and didn’t explain why. I haven’t tried it, see if it works for you.

>>16898484
take some 80× concentrated salvia, scientifically speaking.

>>16900088
How?

>>16898484
maybeeveryone can do this and the whole thing is only meant to make people feel smart?
maybe the people who don't have this ability actually have this ability but due to the wording or their interpretation of what's described think they can't do what is described?

>>16901945
>maybe the people who don't have this ability actually have this ability but due to the wording or their interpretation of what's described think they can't do what is described?
I really wish I could force every person who says this crap to undergo the pupil dilation test.

>>16898937
help us understand exactly what you mean; define your terms:
• visualize
• imagine

>>16901945
The people who have aphantasia show measurable difference in activity in their cuneus and precuneus compared to controls.

>>16901970
>• visualize
fake remembering

>• imagine
it's when you remember something fakely

It’s not REAL

>>16898484
no need for cure

https://rentry.org/p2anyumv

>>16901137
>a real apple is indistinguishable from a imagined apple
schizos pls leave

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wait you see things in your mind like when you watch the television set even if the tv is turned off? you still see a show in your mind after the show is off? or is it more like a holodeck you are in the middle of?

>>16905219
Yes it's basically like a second pseudo-eyesight "elsewhere". But it's not really the same as sight because it lacks precision and realistic physics. It just triggers parts of your cortex that have certain visual associations.
>is it more like a holodeck you are in the middle of
No this is how dreams are like, they feel like they're in front of your eyes. The mind's eye doesn't "feel" like it's in any particular place.

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>>16905227
what does the mind use for "clay" or "parts" to re-arrange to make these "images" that your mind "observes"? bio-photons being emitted inside of your mind and an internal receptor appendage acts like an eye?
more like a chalk board, white board or an etch-a-sketch?

>>16905236
It's just memories stored in your cortex that first originated from optical input. But because you're activating them from within, it doesn't feel like it's coming from your eyes. You recombine information about shit you already know into other stuff. Same process as episodic memory where you reconstruct what you think happen and "relive" it.

>>16898484
This isn’t real. You’re not real.